<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 09/15/14 02:33 PM, Joerg Schilling
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:5416dca2.%2FkgyovmDKAdL9EgG%25Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Nikola M. <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:minikola@gmail.com"><minikola@gmail.com></a> wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On 09/14/14 07:02 PM, Martin Bochnig wrote:
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Furthermore it is nonsense what you write about the CDDL terms. The
CDDL permits the developer to keep the src closed, similar to the Xorg
license.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">I would say it is nonsense what you just said. Re-reading CDDL could
refresh some memories.
Binaries derived from CDDL distributed code that is NOT open source are
ILLEGAL and anyone using those binaries it can be prosecuted (in every
country in the world).
So everyone using binaries that are made from illegally closed source
code is in legal jeopardy.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">
This is not correct: The CDDL is file based and you are allowed to add new
files that you may keep secret. You however need to publish everything you
modified and that was under CDDL.</pre>
</blockquote>
Yeah, but if those file(s) that one adds to CDDL code are - Patches
to original code, <br>
that is the process of making new version of the code, that is
actually changing CDDL code<br>
and does not represent self-sufficient library or subsystem or a
file , that is just linked to CDDL code - Patches to CDDL are
changes and therefore obligated to be published as original license.
<br>
<br>
If one has separate functions, libraries , files and programs, one
can keep them for himself only, yet it is not desired, nor accepted
in open source project.<br>
CDDL just allows one to combine CDDL released code with
libraries/files (not patches) that are not released in one's binary
project:<br>
<ul>
<li>
<p> <b>3.6. Larger Works.</b></p>
<p>You may create a Larger Work by combining Covered Software
with other code not governed by the terms of this License and
distribute the Larger Work as a single product. In such a
case, You must make sure the requirements of this License are
fulfilled for the Covered Software.</p>
</li>
</ul>
Why would one do something like that, except for wanting to be
compatible only with himself and tight users to only that company/or
for closed drivers etc. But it IS giving bigger maneuvering space to
companies and people using their products, then with OS'es with
strong copyleft licenses.<br>
Sun choosed CDDL to be able to integrate parts not open sourced yet,
in OpenSolaris, because some companies holders of that code, even
Sun could not buy out yet, to open their source. <br>
<br>
We have on one side company spending hundreds of millions of dollars
in companies buyouts, to be able to release source under CDDL, and
on the other side someone not understanding that license requires
him to release he's patches.. <br>
And patches are not files that could be left unpublished - they are
contributions - and if not released under same license, leaves
contributor with illegal code.<br>
<br>
CDDL says:<br>
<ul>
<li>
<p> <b>1.9. Modifications</b> means the Source Code and
Executable form of any of the following:</p>
<ul>
<li>
<p><b>A.</b> Any file that results from an addition to,
deletion from or modification of the contents of a file
containing Original Software or previous Modifications;</p>
</li>
<li>
<p><b>B.</b> Any new file that contains any part of the
Original Software or previous Modification; or</p>
</li>
<li>
<p><b>C.</b> Any new file that is contributed or otherwise
made available under the terms of this License.</p>
</li>
</ul>
and<br>
<p> <b>3.1. Availability of Source Code.</b></p>
Any Covered Software that You distribute or otherwise make
available in Executable form must also be made available in
Source Code form and that Source Code form must be distributed
only under the terms of this License.<br>
</li>
</ul>
<blockquote
cite="mid:5416dca2.%2FkgyovmDKAdL9EgG%25Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de"
type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">This is not in the spirit of Copyleft license like CDDL, where changed code is obliged to be released both to the end user and to the public, the moment when derived binaries are distributed.
CDDL is weak copyleft, like LGPL, where one can mix CDDL with otherwise licensed files,
but changes in CDDL code must be released or they represent violation of the license for all users of binaries and are not legal to use unless code is open..
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">
This is why Oracle it in conflict with the CDDL.
Oracle does not own all code from OpenSolaris and for this reason, Oracle would
need to make all related code available in case they modified the code compared
to the version from August 2010.</pre>
</blockquote>
I agree with you, Yet you could consider also some other approaches
such large company could take, besides from taking back all outside
contributed changes , rewriting any external code with their own
versions, being covered by code contribution contracts from Sun days
on top od CDDL, and the fact that CDDL itself states that Sun and
now Oracle is the license Stewart and can change license to whatever
they want.<br>
<br>
My interpretation is, like you, that once opened code can not be
made closed again, (together with all individual contributions with
their copyrights), not even by Oracle. <br>
Yet there could be interpretations that give exclusivity to Oracle
to do whatever they want with code prior to closing source S11
Oracle schism.<br>
<br>
One more interpretation of CDDL is that even all illumos changes
could be used by Oracle, since Sun's name as the license steward is
still inside CDDL license used by illumos.<br>
I was quickly told that is not the case and that Solaris can not
directly reuse illumos code.<br>
But question remains: How license steward could be actually stopped
from doing with CDDL licensed code anything he likes, on any given
moment, when he is in exclusive position to be able to change
license?<br>
<br>
And also I think that you are right, CDDL stating that changed
source must be open after changes are made, is what actually stops
Oracle from including illumos code, because then S11 code would need
to be fully open sourced. <br>
And yet, that is exactly what some people are trying to do against
CDDL provisions, trying to make closed source out of open. But they
are not Oracle and they are forking from illumos, nor Opensolaris.<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:5416dca2.%2FkgyovmDKAdL9EgG%25Joerg.Schilling@fokus.fraunhofer.de"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
As Oracle does not own the rights, Oracle cannot convert CDDLd code to closed
source. But even if they could, they would be in confict with the German law as
the German law forbids to sell copies of copyrighted material in case the
owners of the code are not payed fairly or the code is OSS. Given the fact that
Sun did not pay me for the the code I added to "hsfs" (I own aprox. 1/3 of the
code) Oracle is illegally distributing copies of Solaris.
Jörg
</pre>
</blockquote>
It truly seems that, like when it was required to turn closed code
into open to make Opensolaris open source, it was needed to make
payments to companies owning code, prior releasing it, <br>
that in the same way - turning open and free software contributions
into the proprietary code,<br>
also requires payment to all contributors to the code and therefore
impossible if not Very rich.<br>
<br>
Yet, there are positions that Sun and now Oracle reserved for them
exclusively that could be taken into account.<br>
</body>
</html>