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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 18.08.25 um 01:45 schrieb Atiq
Rahman:<br>
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cite="mid:CABC65rNtFHnii-+GOn1e+wg+AXNuFPRm8fCX5Z69oGb+r-HsBA@mail.gmail.com">
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<div>> OpenIndiana we have a very simple process using
github</div>
<div>Enabling github issues on <a
href="https://github.com/OpenIndiana/oi-userland"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://github.com/OpenIndiana/oi-userland</a>
will help the simplicity</div>
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Like Toomas answered for illumos-gate already, switching the issue
tracker for Openindiana from redmine to github won't change a lot
(other than more depend on Microsoft). Our issue tracker is filled
but only rarely someone is working on reported issues. So adding
another /dev/null device won't change the most pressing problems of
OI.<br>
As I have written several times already: we lack maintainers.
Depending on how one counts them we only have approximately 3 to 15
active maintainers. Most of them are focussed on a single or few
areas of interest. So we have a lot of packages that are problematic
for one reason or another without someone willing to fix them.<br>
It won't help to get more reports on problems without people working
on fixing them.<br>
<br>
I recently talked about packaging chromium with Geoff, our
maintainer for firefox, thunderbird and libreoffice.<br>
He told me that FreeBSD pays a high price for having it packaged;
they have more than 1000 patches to make it work on FreeBSD. Even
after an initial port the amount of work that would be needed to
keep it updated would exceed all our existing resources.<br>
<br>
At the moment I merge PR's without issue tracker reports or links
because the number of PR's is so low and forcing people into a more
sophisticating process would even lower that small number.
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CABC65rNtFHnii-+GOn1e+wg+AXNuFPRm8fCX5Z69oGb+r-HsBA@mail.gmail.com">
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<div><br>
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<div>Same for <a
href="https://github.com/illumos/illumos-gate"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://github.com/illumos/illumos-gate</a></div>
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<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Aug 16, 2025 at
6:36 AM Andreas Wacknitz via oi-dev <<a
href="mailto:oi-dev@openindiana.org"
moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">oi-dev@openindiana.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
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<div>Am 16.08.25 um 15:09 schrieb Peter Tribble:<br>
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<div>
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<div dir="ltr">On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 11:12 PM
Joshua M. Clulow via illumos-developer <<a
href="mailto:developer@lists.illumos.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">developer@lists.illumos.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On
Fri, 15 Aug 2025 at 14:56, Atiq Rahman <<a
href="mailto:atiqcx@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">atiqcx@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
> Thanks to both of you.<br>
<br>
You're welcome!<br>
<br>
> May I suggest we move <a
href="https://www.illumos.org/projects"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://www.illumos.org/projects</a>
to Github or GitLab?<br>
> Old tools look daunting and will
essentially alienate new contributors.
Potential contributors are mostly using
Github/Gitlab IMO.<br>
<br>
It has certainly been considered in the past,
but it really isn't<br>
clear that merely changing to a different bug
tracker or code review<br>
system is going to result in a significant
wave of serious new<br>
contributions.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The telling word there is "merely". It's
not just about substituting one piece<br>
such as the bug tracker for another, it's
about replacing the whole workflow<br>
wholesale.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>And if you were to pitch contribution to a
newly interested person, which of<br>
</div>
<div>the following would be more likely to
succeed?<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>1. Hi! Yeah, set up a completely new
account over here. Fill in a unique<br>
</div>
<div>bugtracker over there. Follow a
non-standard set of processes to create<br>
</div>
<div>a change. Interact with a mailing list,
which may or may not get back to<br>
</div>
<div>you. Interact again with our bugtracker.
Once you've got that far, interact<br>
with a different mailing list, and if you're
lucky your change might get<br>
</div>
<div>committed.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>or:<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>2. Hi! Yeah, just use the exact same
process used for millions of other<br>
</div>
<div>projects, on a system you've probably
already using.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>No contest, really. Our existing processes,
systems, and workflow impose<br>
</div>
<div>significant barriers to contribution, which
might go some way to explain<br>
</div>
<div>why we don't get any new contributors.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>The heavyweight nature of our processes is
also a major barrier that<br>
</div>
<div>discourages contributions by existing
members of the community. If we<br>
</div>
<div>want illumos to improve, then barriers must
be lowered.<br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
The hurdle we actually have is that working on
an operating system is<br>
itself often daunting. It's a large code base
that has been around<br>
for a long time. It's not the kind of
software that most people work<br>
on. There is a sort of implicit assumption, I
guess, that it's going<br>
to be very difficult instead of merely a
different kind of work. This<br>
isn't actually the case, of course: the kernel
is just a big C<br>
program! Anybody can learn enough to
contribute, if they're<br>
motivated.<br>
<br>
I think if you're already keen to contribute,
it's unlikely, on<br>
balance, that the bug tracker is going to be
the reason that you<br>
don't.<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
It won't be *the* only reason, but along with other
impediments, it will<br>
</div>
be *a* reason.<br>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
The problematic process you are referring to is for
illumos-gate.<br>
For OpenIndiana we have a very simple process using
github. You only need to clone our oi-userland repository
to a local build machine and can start right away.
Nevertheless the number of OI maintainers is very low and
new contributors are rare.</div>
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